U.S. Scale Masters

USSMA General Discussions => Flightline Chatter => Topic started by: Cubcrafter on Mon, 09/17/12, 05:03 PM

Title: ScaleMasters Rebirth
Post by: Cubcrafter on Mon, 09/17/12, 05:03 PM
My name is Larry Folk and I would like to introduce myself and put out my thoughts about how ScaleMasters needs to change in order to stop the decline of scale flying.

I have been competing at scale events since 2001. The first event that I went to was the 2001 NATS and I flew a 90” Balsa USA Eindecker in the novice fun scale event and won first place, and have been hooked on scale flying since.

I have competed and placed at ScaleMaster Qualifiers, ScaleMaster Championships and Top Gun. Over the years I have been the contest director for 5 ScaleMasters qualifiers and I base my opinions on this experience.

How to improve ScaleMasters and make it grow.

Eliminate the need to qualify at a local event in order to attend the championships.
This is a concept that is past it's time and is stifling the growth of ScaleMasters. When this was set as the cornerstone of ScaleMasters ARF's were not the force that they are today.
The demographics that make up the hobby have changed and ScaleMasters has to catch up.

Classes

Team Scale
Expert Division 1 – Aircraft without retracting gear
Expert Division 2 – Aircraft with retract gear
Pro-Am Pro
Pro-Am Am

Team Scale is like it is today with the builder and hired pilot.

Expert Division 1 would group aircraft together that have similar flight performance and that would be flown in a similar manner. BOM rule applies.

Expert Division 2 would group aircraft that have higher flight speeds and more robust flight performance envelopes together. BOM rule applies.

Pro-Am Pro would not have a BOM rule and be open to pilots competing in the Team and Expert classes or to anyone that wanted to compete in this class that had higher flight skills. Could use an arf straight out of the box or a built aircraft.

Pro-Am Am is open to the beginner that wants to give scale competition a try. Open to use any type of aircraft, arf or built.


Regional and Local Events

Each time a competitor went to a qualifying scale event they would get the experience of attending a scale event but they would also be awarded a bonus of ΒΌ point that would be added to their static score at the championships. A maximum of 1 point could be accumulated for use at the championships.
This is the best way to get people out to the local events and to support scale flying.

This also gives the local club  the opportunity to have an event where it can promote the hobby, attract interest and bring more people into the clubs.
   
The addition of the Pro-Am classes will increase attendance at the events which will increase the revenue for the clubs and spur companies in the hobby to donate more and better prizes to be given out to the pilots.

A local event may only be a scale fly-in with best of awards and no static or flight judging.

Scoring

Expert and Team static scoring would not be normalized and be from 0 to 100 points.
All flight scoring would be normalized and be based on 100 points not 1000 points.
Pro-am Pro and Am would be awarded 5 static points with a photo that depicts your aircraft's color scheme.

I placed 5th this year at the championships with normalized scoring and I think the above changes to scoring need to be made. Having the different Expert classes will also make the competition better.


Championships

Separate East Coast and West Coast Championships held each year.
East Coast early to mid September and West Coast 2 weeks later.
If someone wanted to attend both they could.

Grand Champion for each coast is determined from the Expert classes.

The success of each championship would be the prime responsibility of the East and West Coast chairmen and their local hosting club.

Have locations for championships set for 3 to 5 years to establish continuity and to build a base upon which to grow the events.


Role of ScaleMasters organization.

ScaleMasters needs to have a presence at as many AMA events as it can across the country from Warbird fly-ins, Dawn Patrol fly-ins and giant scale events. Maybe it can provide a best of award that can be given to a hosting club and promote ScaleMasters at the same time.

I also believe that there should be only one organization for R/C scale flying and that NASA and ScaleMasters should be combined under ScaleMasters. No need for competing organizations of this size to promote the sport. The AMA rules need to be changed to these rules since we are all the same pilots competing and it will cause less confusion.

I realize that all of this has it's pros and cons and will need to be discussed but I believe these are the types of changes that need to be made to get scale flying growing and prospering again.

We need to make all of these changes over the next few months (like between now and the end of the year) and have things setup for 2013.

Thanks for reading this over.

Larry Folk (CubCrafter)
Title: Re: ScaleMasters Rebirth
Post by: Guy Fawcett on Tue, 09/18/12, 04:24 PM
Hi Larry

Qualifications to speak to your suggestions ;).  Flew in my first Scale competition with a scratch built Hawker Fury in the early eighties and flew at the 1991 Scale Masters Champs in Las Vegas.

Scale Masters was built on the premiss of qualifying at local events in order to create grassroots participation in scale.  Not everyone is able or wants to compete at the national level and sometimes just the fact that an individual places and qualifies to go to the Champs gives them the confidence to do just that.

ARFs personally the very idea of these models being eligible to fly at a high level scale competition is confusing.  If you want to wow everyone with your ability to fly, take up Pattern if you want to do this with a scale model join I.M.A.C..  Scale should be for builder/pilots the other events are already there for pilots.

Scale without BOM is not a scale competition and encouraging modellers to think it is, just means that there will be even less interest in building then there already is. I truly do not understand why ARF's should be included scale competition simply because they exist and modellers buy them, if that is the only justification why not allow the use of 3 axis autopilots in Pattern :P.

Personally two things seem to be speeding the continued decline in scale; the increasing size of competition scale aircraft and the decreasing exposure of the general modelling community to building brought about by the proliferation of ARF's.

Until the wide spread introduction of ARF trainers every modeller wanting to learn how to fly built their trainer and any other plane they wanted. Some modellers hated the requirement and others were delighted. But everyone was exposed to building and it was this exposure that produced the greatest number of scale builder/pilots.

ARFs are here to stay until the lack of modellers makes them unprofitable.  How increase scale participation, try having events for smaller models (less time and money to build and transport).  Get rid of non-BOM events except in team and even there make it a requirement that the builder be present at events.

Promote building scale models at every venue possible and ignore ARFs.

Rant Over

Guy Fawcett
Dedicated Scratch Builder.


Title: Re: ScaleMasters Rebirth
Post by: Skymaster on Wed, 09/19/12, 02:52 PM
Larry and Guy,

Larry you have some good ideas on how we may be able to set up the classes. It is very similar to the Mint Julip, which for those who don't know is one of the longest running scale contests in the US. To be antagonistic if we are the best of the best, why do we need to divide the expert classes? Just asking. If you take away the requirement to qualify then why fly the qualifer and have even less exposure at the local level.

As far as combining NASA and Scale Masters, here is the challenge. NASA is the SIG for the AMA. Under NASA there is also scale control line, free flight, helicopters and gliders. NASA is also suppose to pick/field any US Teams we send to the World Championships. What happens to those pilots and the team selection process?

Guy, I agree with you 100% with your passion for building. The reality is that the landscape has changed. There is little value in creating a model. Part of the lack of exposure I think comes from the magazines that are here in the US. It's one ARF review after another. That has to have an affect on the modeling community. Allowing ARFs in competition is in part to help improve pilot participation, a business descision (No pilots, no contest), and to expose the aspiring scale modeler to the class elete competitors (the guys we read about in the magazines). The reality is that if we dont grow our sport, the we'll die on our convictions.

John
Title: Re: ScaleMasters Rebirth
Post by: Guy Fawcett on Thu, 09/20/12, 07:49 PM
Hi John

If there is little value creating a model why bother having scale contests, scale fly ins allow everyone to build or not build so those pilots are already well catered for within the modelling community.

The way to destroy the Scale Masters is to encourage people not to build.  Without builders where does scale differ from any other flying event.

Guy
Title: Re: ScaleMasters Rebirth
Post by: Guy Fawcett on Fri, 09/21/12, 01:01 PM
Hi

My son Alex has suggested something to me that I hadn't thought of to address my concerns about ARFs in Scale Masters.

His suggestion is for an ARF only event in which full Static judging is used in addition to Flying.  This would allow the ARF modders to place better by improving their models and thereby encouraging the application of building skills and historic research.  This type of event would appease the old school scale modellers and the new generation ARF flyers.

Food for thought!

Guy
Title: Re: ScaleMasters Rebirth
Post by: bwboland on Fri, 09/21/12, 02:00 PM
Hello Guy,

You are spot on. We (The BOD and my advisors) have been talking about a ARF only class. I feel it will happen by 2014 assuming the interest is there. Your son has a good feel of our challenges:-)

Bernie
Title: Re: ScaleMasters Rebirth
Post by: Mitchell Baker on Sat, 09/22/12, 02:44 PM
Hi

My son Alex has suggested something to me that I hadn't thought of to address my concerns about ARFs in Scale Masters.

His suggestion is for an ARF only event in which full Static judging is used in addition to Flying.  This would allow the ARF modders to place better by improving their models and thereby encouraging the application of building skills and historic research.  This type of event would appease the old school scale modellers and the new generation ARF flyers.

Food for thought!

Guy

Hi Guy,

I have a question, does your son know about the former Open class? Now something like ProAM/Sport . It is pretty much just that.  99% ARFs, and suppose to be judged on a reduced scale to give the owner things to look for and improve. Educate the owner on what could be done to improve.  But as with any class, unless the Judges give constructive feed back, then it really does not matter what you call it or how you play it..  Also unless the ARF is really "BASHED"  out.. stripped, and much of it rebuilt to follow proper lines, then judging as in expert would be a very low score. Even against other ARFs since your being judged against the documentation not against the other entries. Then if static score gets to a competitive point scoring high with the rebuild ARF then move up to Advanced to see how it stacks up against non-ARFs. 

Our main problem in the past is educating memberships potential contestants and CD's to the complete rules and the changes that have been made in the last 3-5 years.  Really nothing we are doing now is really that new, just repackaging what we currently have.  Except for adding novice pilots to the championships...  ( IMO not a good idea )  and the might be good idea just badly implemented so far normalization of scores....

See-ya
Mitch
Title: Re: ScaleMasters Rebirth
Post by: Guy Fawcett on Sat, 09/22/12, 08:23 PM
Hi Mitch

Seeing your response made me think to download the 2011 competition guide and look at the categories and now I am really confused.

Categories

1. Expert: Pilot must be the Builder of the Model.

2. Team: Pilot is not the  Builder of the Model but the other team member is the Builder of the Model and must be present at the contest to fulfill the definition of a team.

3. Advanced: Pilot is not required to be the Builder of the Model.  Judging criteria for both flying and static are identical to Expert and Team Scale.

4. Open: Pilot is not required to be the Builder of the Model.  Judging criteria for static has a reduced impact of 30 points and flying is identical to Expert and Team Scale.

5. Fun Scale: Pilot is not required to be the Builder of the Model.  Judging criteria for static has a reduced impact of 5 points and flying is identical to Expert and Team Scale.

What are you trying to do for ARF pilots that you haven't already done, there are three events that ARF's are eligible for and two of those can qualify for the Championships.  The way people were talking I thought there was a problem ;D.

Guy ???

Title: Re: ScaleMasters Rebirth
Post by: Mitchell Baker on Sun, 09/23/12, 08:20 AM
That's the question I'm asking as well.   ;D

As I said before, the only real problem I see is the fact that we (USSMA BoD) never did a good job of educating  what the classes were and what programs were out there to help CDs and contestants. 

And really right now, we have not done much except change the names of Fun Scale and Open to match Top Gun classes, again I don't know why that one.. If anything we should be aligning our classes and rules closer to AMA if we want to generate participation. 

But John hit it on the head, the only way we are going to grow is if the current members/builders mentor someone   If we look at what AMA is doing, that is the focus they are taking with the Into pilot program, focus on education and other programs geared at the young to stimulate interest. 

The 1/8 Air Force has be trying to do that with the Young Eagle award for any qualifier participant under 18 to recognize for participating.

USSMA has been developing for the last few years a 1 day fun scale event to help teach novice contestants how to compete and give them experience.  Also a 1 day event is easier to manage than a 2-3 day multi-class qualifier.

The folks up in the NW also came up with a USSMA Boot-Camp  program several years ago to help train pilots and judges. 

And the biggest flaw with all these programs, is/was our lack of education to the members and potential contestants...

Discussions like these are a good way to start!!!!!

See-ya
Mitch



Title: Re: ScaleMasters Rebirth
Post by: Jeffrey Pike on Fri, 10/26/12, 11:42 PM
I have been flying in scale competitions since 1979. I have seen the rise and fall of scalemasters. We got old and died.
My suggestions -
Regionals - Expert I, Expert II (newbee), Team (as is), Advanced (catch all with limited static), Open (newbee with no static). All qualifiers have all classes.
National -  Expert, Team, Advanced, Open

At the regionals the newbee BOM can compete against his peers in the Expert II class. Advanced is the "place to fly" with a level playing field for ARFs vs Estate models. Open is for the rank beginner whether BOM or ARF.

The two Expert classes at the regionals will be combined for the purpose of numbers to qualify for the nationals.

When using "fun fly" as the "Open" event at regionals, do not count the "experts" who fly these events when determining those who qualify. A simply check the box on the entry form will help this work.